7mm AdamF's Scale7 Western Workbench

Dog Star

Western Thunderer
I use Exactoscale rail, chairs and sleepers/timbers... happy to recommend those products. I have had some iffy experiences with C&L chairs and I understand from Len that the difference in raw material may well be addressed now that C&L and Exactoscale are under the same roof.

regards, Graham
 

AdamF

Western Thunderer
That's coming along nicely, although I tend to find that the last 10% of the detailing takes 90% of the time! Not wanting to put you off or anything!

As for the track, I'll leave that to one of the PW specialists, my little demo board I've used steel rail and chairs from exactoscale.

It's certainly feeling like the last detailing will take a disproportionate amount of time! I suspect it's because the return on investment of time gets smaller and smaller in terms of physical changes to the structure - I recall with fondness when an hour or so at the bench turned out a whole rolled boiler!!
 

AdamF

Western Thunderer
I use Exactoscale rail, chairs and sleepers/timbers... happy to recommend those products. I have had some iffy experiences with C&L chairs and I understand from Len that the difference in raw material may well be addressed now that C&L and Exactoscale are under the same roof.

regards, Graham

Thanks Graham - then I think I will go Exactoscale.
 

AdamF

Western Thunderer
Well... an incredibly frustrating return to the bench!!

Everything I have tried on the build today as failed :headbang: It has just been one of those days!

First, I tried to fit the springs behind the front driver splashers only to discover that the clearance with the drivers themselves was, well, non-existent. No problem, I could cut them back, which I proceeded to do. Four broken piercing saw blades later and a chewed up spring detail resulting, the situation was beyond salvage! Lesson learnt? That sort of detail requires lots of pre-planning before the build commences to ascertain whether it will end up requiring a fit in a tight area. If it does, fit it at an earlier stage in the build (even than suggested in the instructions). As for this 517, I think it will have to be completed without spring detail behind the splashers :rant:

But the fun didn't stop there! I then moved on to the next stage in the build which is to fit the handrail knobs. Let's say I didn't succeed! I can't keep them in place (all I can do is burn my fingers). And so I have a plea to the forum - how do you solder handrail knobs in place? All tips, no matter how basic, most welcome!! Just so people know my set up, I am using a Maplin soldering station which has a tip with quite a thick edge so it is difficult to get the business end right into the small right angle between the loco body and the shank of the handrail knob - does this have anything to do with my problems?

Thanks in advance for any steer!

A
 

3 LINK

Western Thunderer
Hi Adam,

Have you any solder cream/paste ? If you have put a dab on the end of the handrail knob, run a piece of handrail through the knob to help keep the handrail knob in position, and wind up the solder station to full power. Then hold the tip of the iron on the head of the knob and the heat transfer should do the rest, use a fairly longish piece of handrail to stop too much heat transferring to your fingers. If you have not got any solder cream then just lightly tin the end of the handrail knob and repeat the above, hope this is of some help.

ATB,

Martyn.
 

alcazar

Guest
Or do as Martyn suggests but hold the handrail knob with a cocktail stick, ensuring it points the correct way before soldering.
 

7mmMick

Western Thunderer
I'm with Martyn, when I solder a handrail and all the nobs I assemble the lot and use a couple of halves of a clothes peg ( a wooden one :) ) and using the cut out for the spring in the peg I put pressure on the wire either side of the nob and hold it at the desired angle and then warm the nob as above,

ATB Mick
 

AdamF

Western Thunderer
Many thanks for the tips guys - I will try that as soon as I can.

Having browsed the web for a bit I have also managed to find what I think might be a very elegant solution to the spring detail problem so all may not be lost on that front :)
 

AdamF

Western Thunderer
Well, THAT was a long time away from the bench!! I can't believe my last post was in February. Nothing has been happening on the 517 since last time - life has rather taken over in the last couple of months!

But I managed to get back to it today - some very gentle progress to ease myself back in. I have built a list of the last things to do to complete the build, and the order in which it would be best to do them and set out today to work through it :thumbs:

First thing was to complete the roof assembly, which will be fixed on post painting and location of the firebox backhead. A gentle run through the rolling bars to get the curve and then soldering in the handrails marked out and fashioned from handrail wire and it's done (apologies for the quality of the pics - iPhone camera, and some of the distortion is pretty bad :)) ) :

IMG_0600 (800x600).jpg

Next was fixing handrail knobs. Following the very kind advice given above, I decided just to epoxy them in using cocktail sticks (as suggested above) to keep the alignment of each one - they are now fixed like rock!

IMG_0598 (800x600).jpg
IMG_0599 (800x600).jpg

That is on one side - to allow a full cure of the epoxy, I will do the other side tomorrow. After that I will have to drill the holes on the tank-tops to allow fixture of further handrail knobs to support the end of the boiler handrails.

Whilst the epoxy was left to cure, I got on with the toolboxes. Putting a roll on the toolbox lids was tricky - rolling bars wouldn't take a piece of metal that small, so ended up having to roll them around a biro with fingers - ouch! Think it has worked, sort of:

IMG_0602 (800x600).jpg

Handles were fashioned from thin wire, marked and bent to fit the pre-prepared holes. I just need to finish the hinge and lock detail and I will be pretty pleased with these.

Nice to get back to building :thumbs:

A
 

7mmMick

Western Thunderer
Great to see you back at the bench Adam, I really like the tool boxes. Lovely job so far and very onspirational,

ATB Mick :thumbs:
 

AdamF

Western Thunderer
Great to see you back at the bench Adam, I really like the tool boxes. Lovely job so far and very onspirational,

ATB Mick :thumbs:

Thanks Mick - if it turns out half as good as your current build I will be very happy!!

Managed to get the handrail knobs fitted to the other flank. No pics of the handrail knobs in place but a couple of action shots (in a sense):

IMG_0604 (800x600).jpg
IMG_0606 (600x800).jpg

Shows a little bit of the method I have used - a small blob of epoxy on the end of a cocktail stick, almost liberally applied inside the handrail knob aperture (which leaves a very small lip of glue to meet the shank as well), cocktail sticks (seen strewn around the work area!) for picking up the knobs and initial test fitting and then alignment with handrail wire once the epoxy has taken a tacky texture (I am using B&Q quick fix stuff - perfectly adequate, it seems).

Testing yesterday's fixtures shows it is a pretty rock-hard join (although I am conscious it isn't mechanical or alloyed!).

The shiny black object in the background is the bottom of a pack of cherry tomatoes we had for yesterday's lunch which I use as a disposeable pallet for mixing the epoxy and the little pieces of wood are some of my most utilised tools :)) I find them really useful for holding things for soldering and also for applying pressure to small items during a gluing process which would otherwise embed themselves in the skin of my finger and move when I try and disapply pressure. Not very high-tech at all, but it gives me a lot of feel which I quite like.

Next looks like it will be drilling and fitting the tank-top handraid knobs, finishing and fitting the toolboxes and fitting the tank-top detail castings.

Mind starting to drift uneasily to how I am going to paint and line...:eek:

A
 

AdamF

Western Thunderer
Some more (slow!) progress today.

I have managed to fit the handrail knobs at the top of the tanks and to put together the step assemblies.

IMG_0670 (800x600).jpg
IMG_0671 (800x600).jpg

I will fit the rear steps to the body after painting to allow access to the axlebox castings (also to be fitted after painting).

All that remains is to paint and then fit the final castings and details (currently left off for ease in painting and lining). Painting will be airbrushing acrylics (I can't spray enamels in my set-up) - I have been busy trying to match acrylic paints to a 1900 GWR livery scheme

IMG_0672 (800x600).jpg

Not very pretty (although the prettiest of the lot!) but quite effective - the light and the camera probably don't show it that well but the green I am looking at is second from the right, the Indian Red equivalent should be easy to spot (I hope :)) - it's one to the left of my proposed green) and the red for the buffer beams and motion area on the inside of the frames is the bottom square. I have invested in some airbrushing kit, have been reading many materials about painting and lining (both from railway modelling and also from military modelling where it seems common to use acrylics for the base coat, seal it with a varnish and then apply weathering effects using oils, enamels and the like).

Next will be some test sprays which I will post when I get the chance. Close to finishing the beast! My eye is starting to wander to choosing the next project...

A
 

AdamF

Western Thunderer
This weekend has been the start of a venture into the unknown for me - my first efforts at airbrushing. I have been practising on scraps mostly. After much deliberation and saving, a couple of weeks ago I invested in an Iwata TR-2 brush with a pistol grip and an Iwata Smart Jet compressor. This set-up is very compact and perfect for my small work area. I have also bought a vent system, which is essentially a portable fan unit, with a filter about the size of an A3 sheet of paper which exhausts, through a flexible duct, out of the window. It can be stowed under the desk when not in use.

To get started with the airbrushing kit and become familiar with the feel of spraying paint through the TR, I started with spraying some well diluted gouache paint on to paper. I was very pleased with how intuitive it was and the degree of control that could be achieved by varying paint flow and distance from the paper to create fine lines (around 1mm) through to an impressive, almost spray-gun fan at distance with full paint flow. There is much more control, perhaps, than the trigger set up suggests. The first depression brings the air on tap and then you can feel more resistance in the trigger, which tells you that the paint will start coming on line with further depression. It really is excellent :thumbs: The compressor is quiet when it runs (sounds a bit like a fridge when it turns on) and then doesn't run much of the time - switching on just to top up the air pressure.

Having cleaned the brush out with some water, it was time to try spraying some acrylics. The first thing I wanted to try was Vallejo's Surface Primer on brass and nickel silver. I tried the black Surface Primer first, neat, and sprayed at about 20-25 psi and it came out of the brush and on to a piece of scrap brass a treat, giving smooth and comprehensive coverage in just a few passes. Cleaning was very easy with Iwata Medea's airbrush cleaner, sprayed through a couple of times into a special cleaning jar (which captures the spray).

So far so good. That is until, having let the primer dry overnight, I managed to peel it off in almost one complete piece having lightly scratched the surface with my fingernail :shit: Not encouraging! Looking at people's experiences on the internet did not make me feel much better either :headbang: Then I realised I had not run the metal through the cleaning regime recommended in all the railway modelling press - I went down the all purpose cleaner, neat, and an acid cleaner after that route. So I tried that regime on two new scrap pieces of brass and sprayed them with primer, grey this time:

IMG_0702 (800x600).jpg

You can see on the above piece of brass (a Collett style cab for the 517, going spare from the sprues!) where the black primer has been scratched away easily.

IMG_0701 (800x600).jpg

I also had a gentle spray over one side of a chassis which I had started and then replaced during the build (wrong gauge spacers were used when I started :rolleyes: ):

IMG_0703 (800x600).jpg

I let the primer cure and, holding my breath, subjected the sprayed items to the scratch test... It's rock hard!! :thumbs: It really is resilient stuff! For a water based, acrylic primer, it is very surprising how well it works! And it seems to me that the difference is all down to following the cleaning regime and then making sure to handle the parts subsequently with latex gloves. Even more surprising has been that it has not given me any trouble at all in clogging the brush or drying too quickly through the air. It is clearly well engineered paint, in my view :thumbs:

On to the 517 itself, then! Time has been running out with all the practising, so the only thing I had time to do was to mask and then prime the wheels:

IMG_0694 (800x382).jpg
Thin tape for the tyre treads and the flanges. The sides of the tyres have been protected with Maskol, a sort of liquid latex solution that can be brushed on and then rubbed off when painting is completed. Maskol also for the crankpins. The wheels were then primed, together with the balance weights, which will be stuck on after painting (they are off for the moment to make sure I have easy access to all the spokes for painting):

IMG_0700 (800x600).jpg

Next paint to be applied to these will be the Indian Red equivalent paint I have found. Chassis next to be primed before an application of black (and crimson for the inner frames around the motion). Then the body after that. That will be next weekend now :))

Lessons learnt from this weekend:

1) I am not going to scrimp on the cleaning regime for brass and nickel silver. Relatively speaking it does not take that long but it makes the world of difference in terms of paint adhesion.

2) So far, I have been very pleased indeed with the acrylics. I had been a bit sceptical, especially after "peelgate", about their ability to do the job instead of enamels. No concerns at all now. That said, I will have to be more careful with the paints (rather than the primers, which are designed to be applied neat from the airbrush). There are loads of useful tips for spraying acrylics in the military modelling press which I am hoping will help (using drying retarder, appropriate thinners etc). I have every hope of using acrylics all the way through.

3) The vent system (an A300 - SD) is worth its weight in gold. I have not had any overspray dust on any surfaces, no smell at all and no paint residues coming out of my nose (not unknown with airbrushes in an unventilated environment, even using water-based paints). And it is pretty quiet - Test Match Special still audible at normal listening volume :))

4) Equally useful is the cleaning station (basically a covered jar with a filter and a hole into which you can insert the airbrush and spray cleaners). No smell and no overspray. The resulting sprayed cleaner and paint residue can then just be tipped into a sink and the jar rinsed with water.

5) In terms of applying the primers, I have found it useful to spray the first bit of paint on to a piece of newspaper, each time the brush pot is filled, before aiming at the object for painting. It has helped me get a feel as to how the paint is coming out at any time before applying it.

Can't wait to carry on!

A
 

AdamF

Western Thunderer
I would recommend you wear a proper mask, even though you have the vent system. Ingesting small particles is not good for the lungs.

You are absolutely right - very good advice. I forgot to mention that I am using a particle mask rated FFP2 - which should filter particles around the 5 micron mark, with overspray being typically in the 10 micron region. Do you have a mask which works well for you?
 

Scale7JB

Western Thunderer
I have the Iwata also, a great piece of kit though strangely very rarely used..

I find Halfords primer and satin black perfect for all previous encounters. All I would say is don't use acrylics for weathering.. When trying to cut back through the weathering with thinners it takes the whole lot off! Why do you think the K2 is so heavy on weathering :( !

JB.
 

AdamF

Western Thunderer
I have the Iwata also, a great piece of kit though strangely very rarely used..

I find Halfords primer and satin black perfect for all previous encounters. All I would say is don't use acrylics for weathering.. When trying to cut back through the weathering with thinners it takes the whole lot off! Why do you think the K2 is so heavy on weathering :( !

JB.

Your K2 is fantastic - I thought the weathering was spot on :thumbs: Interesting to hear that your hand may have been "forced" slightly towards the dirtier end of the spectrum with using acrylics for weathering. It is something that I have been conscious of from the start after seeing the techniques Martyn Welch uses to achieve his wonderful effects. A skim through the military modelling press suggests that the way to do it is to apply the "factory finish" using acrylics and then using a varnish coat to seal it in. Apparently that then allows you to use oils, enamels etc to weather - the varnish (probably depending on the one used) protects the acrylic from the solvents used in the cutting back process. I'd be interested if anyone has any thoughts or experience with this.

A
 

AdamF

Western Thunderer
I do. I need to get some new filters for it, though. :thumbs:

I should say the reason I ask is that I do not want to take any chances with protection against overspray and would welcome any steer on a decent system/know-how from experience :thumbs: I think my particle mask should be fine, but always happy to receive advice on working as safely as possible.

A
 

Heather Kay

Western Thunderer
but always happy to receive advice on working as safely as possible.

I'm lucky in that I have an area set aside for spraying, where overspray and fumes aren't really an issue. I've still taken precautions to limit the amount of dust that gets about - it's not perfect, by a long chalk - and I use a mask because it's the sensible thing to do. It's not an expensive mask. It was bought in our local Machine Mart, and I think it cost less than £20. Importantly, it fits my face and blocks odours almost entirely, so I assume it's filtering out all the nasties successfully.

I need to set some time aside to plan out a better, more permanent spray area. I do enjoy airbrushing, but I'm not geared up for a quick job. Of late, painting has been in almost industrial quantities! If I can set it up so I can do a bit of weathering, or paint a couple of small models in a session, rather than umpteen coach sides, I might enjoy things more. In warmer weather, though, the mask is an uncomfortable proposition.

Sorry, bit of a hijack. :oops:
 
Top